tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5589564.post472843709432846251..comments2024-03-05T21:22:43.426-05:00Comments on parshablog: Is Moshe's forty day (and night) fast super-miraculous?joshwaxmanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03516171362038454070noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5589564.post-11993742409228467452010-02-19T02:08:59.792-05:002010-02-19T02:08:59.792-05:00"this is the sort of miracle in which the der..."this is the sort of miracle in which the derech hateva is not suspended."<br /><br />You'er saying that as much as you can harmonize nature with the Torah's account, you will, until you're stumped.<br /><br />But then we should see that same פלא גדול לא נהיה כמוהו לפניו, on these specific aspect.<br /><br />Truly, what difference does it make if there was a strong wind blowing before krias yam suf, if the actual splitting was an unnatural neiss. (assuming it was.)<br /><br />Now, you could say that as far as a neiss wasn't needed, it wouldn't be done. But that goes for the neiss itself. God doesn't *need* them.Yosef Greenberghttp://blog.yachdus.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5589564.post-47787468793770375352010-02-17T08:39:11.897-05:002010-02-17T08:39:11.897-05:00"You forgot it's also in Ki Sisa 34:28, a..."You forgot it's also in Ki Sisa 34:28, and there it's not Moshe talking."<br /><br />true. thanks.<br /><br />"Its kind of risky, allegorizing whatever doesn't fit a particular world-view. Thats besides being, potentially, apologist."<br />absolutely. if i didn't first think it sounded like an idiom (like Etzba Elokim), such that it would be motivated by a text-internal impetus, then i would regard it as an apologetic.<br /><br />"BTW, what was the *natural* pshat for the mahn?"<br />the mann is certainly intended as miraculous. but the slav was also miraculous. the miracle was that this existing flock(s) of birds was blown regularly into the Israelite camp. just as the locust were blown in and out of Egypt. whether the manna came from a special prepared Otzar (since, after all, Pirkei Avot informs us that it was created Erev Shabbos), and rained down, just like rain or snow; or if Hashem caused it to form each day using natural or miraculous means (or if it was blown in from some growing atop some mountain, if you <b>really</b> want a naturalistic explanation), in the end, it fell in the field. People went out to collect it; they cooked it; they ate it, and that provided them with sustenance. this is the sort of miracle in which the derech hateva is not suspended. but for Moshe's natural body processes to go on for 40 days and 40 nights, while he breathed and functioned, but did *not* take in nutrients -- <b>that</b> would constitute a continuous suspension of the laws of nature. this is not the way that Ibn Ezra understands the operation of miracles, in general. so not so much "natural", but rather a "naturalistic" type of miracle, and a miracle nonetheless.<br /><br />kt,<br />joshjoshwaxmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05149022516101476797noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5589564.post-29892110469898078942010-02-17T00:58:33.372-05:002010-02-17T00:58:33.372-05:00Its kind of risky, allegorizing whatever doesn'...Its kind of risky, allegorizing whatever doesn't fit a particular world-view. Thats besides being, potentially, apologist.<br /><br />But a nice idea, nonetheless, which I disagree with, joke aside.<br /><br />Moshe mentioned both, eating and drinking, which somewhat weakens the idea. But I do see the idea against it.<br /><br />BTW, what was the *natural* pshat for the mahn?Yosef Greenberghttp://blog.yachdus.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5589564.post-39968183140057789942010-02-16T21:52:56.081-05:002010-02-16T21:52:56.081-05:00You forgot it's also in Ki Sisa 34:28, and the...You forgot it's also in Ki Sisa 34:28, and there it's not Moshe talking.<br /><br />There are actually three approaches to this; see Likutei Sichos vol. 36, summarized in the Gutnick Chumash.Shmuelnoreply@blogger.com